the eighth
A brief break from the Post Office’s concern that we get our cards and parcels done, because I thought this small, chilly chap suited the weather.
And don’t forget to put some bird food out.
Tag: WW2 poster
Selling, cont.
There were so many railway and London Transport posters in the Onslows catalogue, that I ran out of time on Friday to consider the rest. So, today, any other business.
The bulk of this is World War Two posters. Onslows usually have a fair selection and this sale is no different.
Clixby Watson, est. £100-150
The most interesting, for me at least, are a pair of Mount Evans posters.
Mount Evans, est. £200-250
Mount Evans, est. £100-150
The second one, along with the anonymous fuel poster before, are making an appearance for the second time this year. So it remains to be seen whether they will make their estimates or not.
Anonymous, est. £50-100
But I still like them both.
There are also an interesting set of posters by Heinz Kurth. This is the prime one in the listing.
Heinz Kurth, est. £50-100 (4)
Of Welsh interest, clearly. But I actually prefer the three subsidiaries, which are both striking and good.
Heinz Kurth, est. £50-100 (4)
Then there are lots of other ones which are clearly classic and of great interest to collectors, but aren’t necessarily great pieces of design (like Bateman cartoons about saving fuel, for example). Or like this.
Anonymous, est £100-150.
Now if that makes its estimate, I will eat my warm woolly socks. But I shall do so quite happily, because we’ve got a copy of it – don’t ask me why – which we got on eBay for less than a tenner. Actually that probably tells you why we’ve got it. But if anyone wants to pay £100+ for it, I am definitely open to offers.
Related to the World War Two material, there are also quite a few National Savings posters. Mr Crownfolio has pointed out that I keep omitting these from my lists of posters that have been collected, when quite a few of them do survive. He’s right, but I think I keep leaving them out because while they may be interesting pieces of social history, the vast majority aren’t actually good design.
Anonymous, c.1940, est. £40-50
J P Sayer, est. £50-70
It’s an interesting question as to why the National Savings didn’t pay the same close attention to design that the GPO or even HMSO did at the same time. But it’s not one I have a ready answer to – any suggestions? There are a couple of exceptions to this rule, and two of them are also in this sale.
Eric Fraser, est. £70-100
Myerscough Walker, est. £80-120
Although I’m not entirely convinced about the Myerscough Walker, but it’s still better than most.
What there isn’t – and it’s a rare contrast to almost every other selling emporium in Britain – is a plethora of coach posters being redistributed after the Morphets sale. Just a few of this type, which are not unpleasant.
Peter Andrews, est. £100-150
The rest is miscellaneous. I never knew that Schweppes once made cider, for example.
Anonymous, est. £300-400
And looking at that picture, I don’t think that Babycham was an entirely new idea, either.
But this miscellaneous category also contains what are to my mind two of the finest posters in the sale. They’re both by Clifford and Rosemary Ellis, and they’re both wonderful.
Clifford and Rosemary Ellis, 1935, est. £250-300.
Clifford and Rosemary Ellis, 1945, est £200-300
I covet both of these very much. Here’s the catalogue for the wallpaper exhibition for your further delectation.
This could be yours from Abebooks for a bit over £30. Cheaper than a poster, that’s for sure.
Small but perfectly formed
So, back on the auction rounds once more, and first in our sights is Van Sabben, on December 11th.
I’ve already skipped through a few of the French ones in passing last week, but there are also a small selection of British posters in there which are worth looking at.
Lewitt Him, c.1947, est. €250
Like the Vegetabull, to start with. Everyone should own this poster.
But in addition to that, it’s a small, but quite interesting selection. There’s something for everyone. Some railway posters, like this faintly murky Fred Taylor.
Fred Taylor, 1930, est. €450
And this rather wonderful piece of glamour. In as much as Felixstowe can do glamour.
Nicoll Gordon, 1930, est. €2,000
There’s a really lovely Abram Games too, which I’ve always rather liked.
Abram Games, 1944, est. €450
As well as a few more of his posters which, while brilliant pieces of design, I nonetheless wouldn’t much fancy having up on the wall.
Abram Games, 1943, est. €650
Especially if I have to pay €650 for the rather morbid pleasure.
But one thing that I really like about the Van Sabben auctions is that, even though they don’t have that many British posters, they’re not just comprised of the usual suspects. So in addition to Abram Games and Tom Eckersley,
Tom Eckersley, 1947, est. €250
there are also posters by Henrion.
FHK Henrion, 1945, est. €280
And Beverley Pick and Reginald Mount too.
Beverley Pick, 1947, est €250
Reginald Mount, 1946, est. €650
And even Robin Day.
Robin Day, c.1950, est. €450.
I’m assuming that’s the furniture designer rather than the interviewer.
It’s not just that they have a good mix of designers, they also get posters from different sources. Like these two from the GPO, which are also both large format rather than 1o x 15.
Zero, 1942, est. €300
Manfred Reiss, 1950, est. €300
I’d love to know where they source their posters from, but I don’t suppose they’ll tell me.
My only minor complaint is the pricing. It’s hard to work out how the Vegetabull can be worth so much less than this Hans Schleger, for example, when they’re both in similar condition.
Zero, 1943, est. €500
It does sometimes feel as though estimages are obtained by sticking a pin into a roulette wheel. Mind you, I shouldn’t be complaining; that’s the way that bargains are made, after all.
Edge wear
And still they keep c0ming. Today – cue drum roll – it’s eBay Watch. Along with a bit of complaining from me.
Don’t get me wrong, I’ve got no problem with what’s out there. Because there’s loads of it.
Let’s start with this Aer Lingus poster, which is very stylish.
Although it’s in German it was printed in Ireland and is by Bainbridge. This is almost certainly the John Bainbridge whose London Transport poster I mentioned the other day (and about which more later).
Then there’s this lot.
They’re all by Beath, all from 1936 and they will cost you £49.50 a poster at the moment. I also think that they’re all rather good bits of modern typography.
But what pains me is that the descriptions say that they have all three been mounted on canvas. Now it may just be that they’ve been stored badly (that’ Mr Crownfolio’s theory) but even if that’s so, they’re in pretty poor condition for a mounted poster. I also can’t see any of the mount around the edges, which is a bit odd.
Now if these were the only examples, I wouldn’t be so bothered. But it’s happening elsewhere. The Henrion and Bainbridge posters that I mentioned yesterday also claim to be linen backed. But the Bainbridge in particular is in even worse condition – take a look at the edges.
And again, no edges of linen to be seen.
So what’s going on? Is there just an outbreak of fibbing on eBay? Or, more kindly, of sellers who haven’t seen a mounted poster before. Or is there someone doing cut-price poster mounting and not doing it very well? Or have I just got the wrong end of the stick altogether?
And finally, this.
My beef here is with the description:
On offer here is a beautiful original Percy Drake Brookshaw travel poster dating to the mid 20th century circa 1950’s.
Yes, it’s by Percy Drake Brookshaw, yes it’s original. But no, it is definitely not beautiful. Just look at it.
They (an eBay based antiques dealer in Chippenham) also want £200 for it, which is a bit steep considering that I distinctly remember it going for about £40-60 at auction earlier this year.
There ought to be large signs all over the relevant bits of eBay, warning people that just because a poster is old, that doesn’t necessarily mean that it’s valuable. The same applies to the Beaths above. £49.95 isn’t as much, but it’s still a lot when you think that we bought a similar (and in fact better because nicely mounted on linen and therefore flat) Beath Winter Number for just £7.99 only last year.
Right, enough complaining. On the positive side, you could have this smiley chap by Daphne Padden for a mere £4 or so at the moment.
As well as a ton of WW2 posters from this seller. They’re not the most visually appealing – this is probably the best of the bunch.
Once more, they’re not cheap,with opening prices from £50 for this, to £200 for a fairly tatty Norman Wilkinson. Perhaps I’ll come back to this post next week and see how they all fared.
Right to copy?
We’re all about questions today on Quad Royal. Or rather, one question in particular: just how much of what is sold in the poster department of eBay is in fact legal?
The reason I’m asking is that, I was playing with the eBay app on the iPad, and so stumbled back into their bottomless pit of poster reproductions. Normally there’s a whole set of clever filters and searches (operated and maintained by Mr Crownfolio) which means that I don’t even notice that these items exist. But on the iPad, none of this is set up, and so an idle search for ‘vintage poster’ reminded me of the sheer volume of prints, giclee prints and A3 photocopies that are out there should you want them.
They range from reasonable quality,
to ones where even the seller isn’t convinced about the reproduction.
These posters are meant to be affordable reproductions of vintage posters that are rare and hard to acquire elsewhere. There are more expensive and higher quality prints out there. Our posters look great on the wall but may not stand up to a thorough examination. I fully admit the small print may be blurred and slight pixelation may occur on certain prints. These are fun items, not works of art.
Despite that write-up, he is still selling them. By the hundreds every month, judging from his feedback.
But I’m not asking philosophical questions about the relative values of reproductions versus originals this time. I’m just wondering how legal these are?
The basics of copyright are quite simple, that if an artist died after 1945, their work is protected for 70 years after their death. Which means that if a seller is selling a print of a 1950s railway poster (for £4.99, printed on a photocopier or bubblejet printer), there is a reasonable chance that they are infringing copyright somewhere along the way. The example above, incidentally, is by Jack Merriott, who died in 1968).
But what happens after that? Do you need to be the legal owner of a piece to have the right to reproduce it? Let’s take this 1923 poster by Grainger Johnson as an example.
No one seems to know much about him and his biography, so we will be generous and assume it is out of copyright. Does that then make it fair game for the eBay copyists? Or do they need to own a copy of the poster in order to have the right to reproduce it? I don’t know, and I would like to.
The next question is whether the nature of a commercial contract changes copyright too? (This link seems to suggest it does). So if a poster is commissioned by Shell, or London Transport or British Railways, do they still own the rights over the image? And for how long – for the same 70 years as the artist or until the company ceases to exist?
In other words, can these reproduce this 1930 Charles Burton as much as they like on their bubblejet printer, or should London Transport be consulting a lawyer?
Finally, is this also true of Crown Copyright, in particular where this applies to the huge number of World War Two posters which are being reproduced?
Questions, questions. But can anyone out there help me answer them?
Calling You
While I am sure that you are all now saving up every last penny for the Christies sale, there are a couple of good odds and ends on eBay right now. And, not surprisingly, they are a bit cheaper.
Pick of the pops are these two ARP posters, being sold by one MrsLovely.
The McKnight Kauffer I have seen before (not least because we have a smaller version on our sitting-room wall) but I don’t think I’ve ever come across the Keely until now.
What’s interesting is that if you take a flick through MrsLovely’s feedback and past sales, you will discover that she’s already sold one copy of the Keely (for the £120 asking price) and two copies of the McKnight Kauffer. So someone, somewhere must have come across a stash of pre-war ARP posters which were never used. Which does give me hope that there are still plenty more old posters out there waiting to be discovered. By me, preferably.
Also in her past sales, I found this Paul Nash.
It’s a collotype proof for Urne Buriall (enough to recommend it on its own) and a rather wonderful thing to get should you have had £180.
If you’re feeling rather more lighthearted, though, you could always plump for this wide-eyed giraffe.
A little eaten, but still currently quite covetable at £39.99.
And finally, proof that aesthetic value isn’t everything in posters, particularly when there’s railways involved.
This 1960s Christmas poster went for just £14.49 a few days ago.
While this one from the late 40s made £72.
Now, in a fight on looks alone, I think I’d probably just pick the 1961 poster, although I probably wouldn’t put either of them on the wall.
So why did the second one make so much more? Yes, it’s older. And yes, it does also have a certain historical value as a record a period when British Railways had only just been formed but the identities of the pre-war railway companies hadn’t entirely disappeared yet (although you could read them on this poster as going up in flames). But even that, surely, can’t make almost £60 worth of difference. It has to be just the sheer fact of those names being there which has given this poster the extra value. Strange, but true.
Both of these posters, incidentally, came from the Malcolm Guest collection, which means that I can tell you that the seller spent £65 on them and so is just about in profit, with four more posters to go.